Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

[knutstransport]

Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May
BBC reporting that buses and coaches which don't meet Euro 6 standards will be banned from next May.

Bus operators will be able to get subsidies for retrofitting but any operator using non-compliant vehicles will pay a daily fine.

I wonder if this will mean more consistent allocations for some cross border services like D&G's 88 & 130 and WOB's CAT5?

[iMarkeh]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May
I like how all of these clean air zones focus on buses but not cars who are the main polluter.

I think D&G will struggle originally as combined it's around 7/8 buses which need to be euro 6.

WOB could manage it if they were consistent and kept branded buses on the routes.

An interesting one I think will be the cross border operators who throw anything and everything on the routes and interwork a lot. First on their Todmorden buses, HTL, Cumfybus, Hattons. Hulleys

[knutstransport]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

(21/06/2021 19:22)iMarkeh Wrote:  I like how all of these clean air zones focus on buses but not cars who are the main polluter.

There was a mention of petrol cars from 2006 or newer already meeting the same emission standards which will be required for buses and coaches.

Taxis and vans will also have to meet Euro 6 standard but this is obviously a bus forum so the implications for bus and coach operators are more relevant.

[Mrboo]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May
Time to buy Ex London Buses then as a stop gap.

[knutstransport]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

(21/06/2021 19:54)Mrboo Wrote:  Time to buy Ex London Buses then as a stop gap.

There's many ex-London buses around currently. I'm presuming you mean replace 2006-2009 ex-London vehicles (commonplace currently) with newer ones.

[iMarkeh]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

(21/06/2021 19:34)knutstransport Wrote:  There was a mention of petrol cars from 2006 or newer already meeting the same emission standards which will be required for buses and coaches.

Taxis and vans will also have to meet Euro 6 standard but this is obviously a bus forum so the implications for bus and coach operators are more relevant.

No private vehicles are affected by the charge at the moment. Only commercial vehicles.

(21/06/2021 19:54)Mrboo Wrote:  Time to buy Ex London Buses then as a stop gap.

I think that they are good but operators need to put the money in to make them single door. I know a good few operators are running these buses as they are bought without being accessible. Officially they have the electric ramp and stuff but infrastructure isn't built for dual door buses and some operators disable the electric ramp or lock the centre doors so overall, the buses aren't accessible. I have no issue with using Ex London buses as long as they are converted or dual doors are in full use, at all times.

Being honest, I think much of it will come down to reallocations with Euro 6 buses being moved in specifically for the clean air zone. Much like Arriva and First did in Leicester and again Arriva with the London clean air zone more recently (moving the buses about so that the 724 has the E200MMCs). Not sure about purchasing many more buses. I guess it depends how much money is given out to help operators and how much operators are willing to pay up. How many operators will just pay it and put up the price of tenders as I am sure that some will do that if they can to cover the costs. All depends on how much support is given then from there, any left overs will likely try to be moved out and swapped. No one wants to buy buses really it seems for these clean air zones, just retrofit and move buses about if they can.

[Mrboo]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

(21/06/2021 22:00)iMarkeh Wrote:  No private vehicles are affected by the charge at the moment. Only commercial vehicles.


I think that they are good but operators need to put the money in to make them single door. I know a good few operators are running these buses as they are bought without being accessible. Officially they have the electric ramp and stuff but infrastructure isn't built for dual door buses and some operators disable the electric ramp or lock the centre doors so overall, the buses aren't accessible. I have no issue with using Ex London buses as long as they are converted or dual doors are in full use, at all times.

Being honest, I think much of it will come down to reallocations with Euro 6 buses being moved in specifically for the clean air zone. Much like Arriva and First did in Leicester and again Arriva with the London clean air zone more recently (moving the buses about so that the 724 has the E200MMCs). Not sure about purchasing many more buses. I guess it depends how much money is given out to help operators and how much operators are willing to pay up. How many operators will just pay it and put up the price of tenders as I am sure that some will do that if they can to cover the costs. All depends on how much support is given then from there, any left overs will likely try to be moved out and swapped. No one wants to buy buses really it seems for these clean air zones, just retrofit and move buses about if they can.

I know a company who had arriva Enviro200 they was in service hrs before they picked them up they was Single door used round Enfield. they was on Rail replacment that weekend and week after had the bus destination blinds changed to Colour LED and was good to go round Essex. it not that hard to change a bus from TFL spec as Vision bus has been buying a number of ex London buses. And good workshop can do few days. I could see Arriva sending buses to Bolton even Go ahead could do it but I feel they would just get the mod for there buses. The one to keep eye on is First as they need to sort there buses out

[NorthernCounties]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May
Its all fairly easy to sort out on the bus front, especially with the euro 6 retrofit program going on funded by tfgm, but its the coach industry that'll struggle. People like rothwells in Heywood and elite over cheadle have a fairly old fleets and its doubtful they could find the several hundred thousand pounds to upgrade their fleets. The new healings/Roberts travel have only been running a short time and there's no way his reserves will be good enough to fund a euro 6 coach yet.
And I've still heard silence about government funding to upgrade vehicles, but how does £5000 help when you're looking at a £100,000 bill?
There's also the reduction in tourists and visitors when outside coach companies can't pass the extra £100 a day onto passengers.
Not forgetting haulage firms like Barretts in Oldham that are still running their ultra reliable ERFs and doubtful they can upgrade their whole fleet too

Its all very short sighted and political

[thomasl1231]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May
I agree with the cars factor; they (used) to reckon an avg decker took 70-odd cars off the road, which would give a lot more pollution than just one bus on euro4 for example, I do not understand the mass focus on buses etc in these clean air zones.

Is it definitely only for commercial vehicles? My preserved buses are in the mcr zone - does it mean I have to pay £60 every time I want to take them out if it turns out it affects them all?

[knutstransport]

RE: Euro 6 engines only allowed in Greater Manchester from next May

(22/06/2021 09:34)thomasl1231 Wrote:  Is it definitely only for commercial vehicles? My preserved buses are in the mcr zone - does it mean I have to pay £60 every time I want to take them out if it turns out it affects them all?

The way I read it whether you get an exemption would depend what the buses are used for. If you offer them as private hire vehicles for events like weddings then you would not be exempt, as buses used on private hire work aren't exempt. If, on the other hand, your buses are on display in the Transport Museum and you occasionally take them out for your own personal use then maybe an exemption would apply.